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Strategic Defence Review & the Emerging Threats


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Believe there is no dedicated thread of this sort which will help Pakistan,

Just to align the emerging threats and How prepared is Pakistan to deal with such threats ?

How Pakistanis, its Military and Civilian Institutes can cope with it and whether it could cause serious

chaos.

Finally, if there is a need for a proper Strategic or Defence Review in curtailing costs/expenditure to Emerging Threats as a result of Economic crisis !!!

Future Emerging threats to Pakistan:

- War.

- Cyber/Internet attacks - Cyber and Computer warfare.

- Geo-strategic threats.

- Future Major accident or Natural Disaster.

- Terrorism and Extremism.

- Economic and Financial threat.

- Law and Order problem.

- Drug Trafficking.

- False flag threats.

- External and Internal threats.

Thanks Usman S.

Further it can be classed or catergorised in another manner:

Warfare:

Military:

Strategic:

Defence:

Space:

Main aim is to "Priotise", through Pakdef members own discreation and way forward.

This is more future based on strategic re-alignment and emerging threats.

Thanks !!!

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Clearly AM Shahid Latif is the kind of person I would love talking to for hours upon hours about PAF, Pakistani politics, international relations, etc. His personality is such that you want to discuss with him in order to arrive at solutions instead of arguing to prove a point. He's willing to admit mistakes and is eager to move forward for the betterment of everyone... This is a trait of a true sincere leader.

I would really love to see PakDef (Usman S, H Khan) arrange a proper interview-series with him about current affairs, PAF, etc...

PS: Dawn and Pakistani news channels are trying too hard with the "Hard Talk" approach, just argue, debate, yell, shout, etc...of course you're going to get interruptions and what not. What we need is 2-3 hour slots where people sit down, discuss and reach concrete solutions, where time is given for context, theory, history, etc, to be said and where viewers are given the chance to think and contemplate. Unfortunately, today's people (all over the world) don't have that sort of patience...

Faisal, all the solutions are already known. What is not there is the will to implement them. And no amount of talk shows can give the leadership that will.

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Faisal, all the solutions are already known. What is not there is the will to implement them. And no amount of talk shows can give the leadership that will.

If we lack the will, then we have a problem...and that too needs a solution of its own, and it can come from one of the following places: the people and/or power-brokers capable of changing leadership. For one reason or another, that active push for substantive change hasn't clicked into the minds of a lot of people - wealthy, poor and whatever remains in the middle. Thinking for the sake of solving problems is what needs to be promoted, not thinking for the sake of supporting the least corrupt figure, to justify prejudices, or to defend preconceived assumptions or ideals (famous democracy vs dictatorship issue).

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If we lack the will, then we have a problem...and that too needs a solution of its own, and it can come from one of the following places: the people and/or power-brokers capable of changing leadership. For one reason or another, that active push for substantive change hasn't clicked into the minds of a lot of people - wealthy, poor and whatever remains in the middle. Thinking for the sake of solving problems is what needs to be promoted, not thinking for the sake of supporting the least corrupt figure, to justify prejudices, or to defend preconceived assumptions or ideals (famous democracy vs dictatorship issue).

And who would promote that? People cant do that. At least no yet because Pakistan still has some way to go before it hits the rock bottom. As for the power brokers, you know them better than me. :)

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And who would promote that? People cant do that. At least no yet because Pakistan still has some way to go before it hits the rock bottom. As for the power brokers, you know them better than me. :)

Stuff will/could happen when/if educated relatively comfortable Pakistanis figure out that they have their obligations. They might number in the few millions or less, but the power and influence they wield can substantively change the direction of the country in terms of economy, politics, etc.

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As far my personal opinion I was quite surprised not to see him becoming our ACM. Surely we have many more very competent leaders but personal mr Lateef was my favorite because he was program manager of JF17. Like our Naval chief who is a close friend of mr Zardari I have a feeling that they elected someone who never would rise his voice. The same story when the elected Musharraf. Dirty politics are not making Pakistan stronger.

the current ACM wife is some how related to zardari.

The current CNS brother is the foreign sec. and his sister is a sec. as well plus one of is close relations is a mna/mpa from ppp.

They are both safarashis and the result is their for all of us to see.

When u see wt the ACM and CNS are doing to their respective organizations than u realize that when the army forced the present govt. to give the COAS an extension (the coas in turn gave the DG ISI extension twice) was a very good thing otherwise we would have a safarashi as COAS as well.

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It is not about what they belief but whether they are related somehow to Zardari. In that case it is not an objective selection.

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few points that i deduct from his interviews:

1) While it was great to see a single participant in the interview, which is far better than inviting four participants and than not able to listen to any of them, this anchor should learn to listen more and speak less. he has two ears and one tongue.

2) How postings at the top level of military has been affected by "likes" and "dislikes" of our stupid politicians and Americans.

3) At least he is trying to present to us different options to move forward from this mess. We sure need people of his likes at policy making, who are sincere to the nation. You can convince sincere people if they are wrong, but you cannot convince those who are ready to sell themselves for few dollars.

4) He explains why PAF did not pick up choppers on May 2. Because of no threat perception from western side.

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It is not about what they belief but whether they are related somehow to Zardari. In that case it is not an objective selection.

Belief ! wt belief, they only believe in making them self rich as they see it as a pay day and nothing more. how they achieve it or how it damages the institutions is least of their worries.

Just look wt that chor gilani has done to all the govt. institutions under his control. The changes their DG/MD/ministry sec. after every six months, every position is up for sale. the more lucrative the position the the higher the price.

I can tell u for a fact that the price of chairman CDA is 1 billion RS and ppl are willing to pay for it infact ppl who want to have certain things done are willing to pay for it on behalf of their person.

just look at wt they have done to NHA, it until a few years ago was the most profitable govt. org. it annual budget was over 70 billion. But now the situation is that they they had to pay a contractor a sum of 20 crore but couldn't so the contractor went into litigation and won the case. SO NHA had to mortgage it property to raise the funds to pay the contractor. All this due to the son of the chor gilani.

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Belief ! wt belief, they only believe in making them self rich as they see it as a pay day and nothing more. how they achieve it or how it damages the institutions is least of their worries.

Just look wt that chor gilani has done to all the govt. institutions under his control. The changes their DG/MD/ministry sec. after every six months, every position is up for sale. the more lucrative the position the the higher the price.

I can tell u for a fact that the price of chairman CDA is 1 billion RS and ppl are willing to pay for it infact ppl who want to have certain things done are willing to pay for it on behalf of their person.

just look at wt they have done to NHA, it until a few years ago was the most profitable govt. org. it annual budget was over 70 billion. But now the situation is that they they had to pay a contractor a sum of 20 crore but couldn't so the contractor went into litigation and won the case. SO NHA had to mortgage it property to raise the funds to pay the contractor. All this due to the son of the chor gilani.

Well, the people of Pakistan elected them. And what do you think is done in the rest of the world. Maybe you should read about the election of US president. The groups behind the financing of it. Or the way USA acts against certain nations (economical dictating). I can only say that somehow it is the direct result of the electorate and I would not be so sure whether they learned something from it. There is a big fraud in trias politicas. No one really is able or does control the political side. Neither are they responsible after they left office. And if even the degrees are just window dressed then you can tell what they do with real politics. Trust me, you do not want to be in it. No wonder that technocrats run away from the normal politicians.

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Well, the people of Pakistan elected them. And what do you think is done in the rest of the world. Maybe you should read about the election of US president. The groups behind the financing of it. Or the way USA acts against certain nations (economical dictating). I can only say that somehow it is the direct result of the electorate and I would not be so sure whether they learned something from it. There is a big fraud in trias politicas. No one really is able or does control the political side. Neither are they responsible after they left office. And if even the degrees are just window dressed then you can tell what they do with real politics. Trust me, you do not want to be in it. No wonder that technocrats run away from the normal politicians.

SO wt it basically proves (n i am not talking just about Pak) is that democracy in wt ever shape or form is a faliure/fraud in which it is basically the king maker, the people calling the shots from behind the scene who has the cake and gets to eat it too

They invest in a stooge to do their bidding and their dirty work without getting their hands dirty.

But it serves the people (across the world) right for not being able to see past the facade and electing all these stooges.

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SO wt it basically proves (n i am not talking just about Pak) is that democracy in wt ever shape or form is a faliure/fraud in which it is basically the king maker, the people calling the shots from behind the scene who has the cake and gets to eat it too

They invest in a stooge to do their bidding and their dirty work without getting their hands dirty.

But it serves the people (across the world) right for not being able to see past the facade and electing all these stooges.

please keep this thread for PAF only

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As much as I respect the esteemed AVM, one must remember that the violation of our sovereignty started under his watch as both the DCAS Ops and as VCAS. What he proposes I.e shoot down of a few choppers while losing a few of our F-16s should have been done when the US UAVs started their campaign in the tribal areas. If that was allowed under some compulsions in his time in the PAF then he should understand that his successors are probably in the same bind. Why does OBL raid become so different from the strikes on tribals in which all sorts of people, combatants & non combatants, have died?

Americans breached our territorial integrity during his time as VCAS and are doing so now as well. Why did we not think about sacrificing our fleet then?

Like most others here, it pains me to point these issues out but I feel passing the buck has to stop on both sides i.e. Civil & military. Our military men and the politicians all spring forth from the same land of the "pure" and bear equal responsibility for the bind our country is in. Like all others appearing on TV, our civvies and military men suddenly become the fountain head of integrity, jurrat and democracy once they are no longer in the job while in it they all act inconsequentially and gutlessly. The esteemed VCAS should have resigned his commission when the Americans were allowed to violate our airspace if he felt constrained to act politically. However if he did not do so because that made sense from the standpoint of preserving our interests then he should offer up the same to those who are in command or advising those in command now, as he himself was in the past.

Couldnt agree more - he, like those before him, only regain the moral compass once they are no longer in charge.

ndad

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Maybe you should watch economic hitman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confessions_of_an_Economic_Hit_Man) and understand that being in power has its limitations. Let us remind that sending pilots to the USA means that these will have some impact on their careers. You all read about that USA was pushing to get officers (re-)educated in the USA so they would more listen to USA and act pro USA.

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While I feel so much pain in Pakistanis get killed everyday, I am against any kind of offensive gesture on national TV about killing or destroying American assets and hence American lives.

Esteemed AVM has shown his distorted vision about realities of the world. This is good for local consumptions but we as a nation are not in a position to cutoff US trade (read I am not saying aid) or get sanctioned and further isolated in the comity of world.

Fact is, the USA is the biggest trade partner we have and before these suggestions are made, we have to put together a plan to get on our feet economically.

Lets move on is what I sugget.

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He didn't advocating destroying any American assets. What he did say was you should make policies that are in your national interest. He gave the example of Turkey that did not provide facilities in second Gulf War and continues to be on friendly relations. His perspective was quite logical in terms of how you should proceed and how other countries proceed in there own national interest.

While I feel so much pain in Pakistanis get killed everyday, I am against any kind of offensive gesture on national TV about killing or destroying American assets and hence American lives.

Esteemed AVM has shown his distorted vision about realities of the world. This is good for local consumptions but we as a nation are not in a position to cutoff US trade (read I am not saying aid) or get sanctioned and further isolated in the comity of world.

Fact is, the USA is the biggest trade partner we have and before these suggestions are made, we have to put together a plan to get on our feet economically.

Lets move on is what I sugget.

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The economy of Turkey is half of all the economies from Pakistan to Morocco.

We are really broke! by any yardstick. I do not have to go into details.

We need to focus on the enemy and use all might against TTP and affiliates.

We also need to show wisdom and maturity to take one on the chin and move on.

I have my faith in Pak forces and I know steps are being taken to avoid these mishaps in future. However, an effort needs to be made to sideline the American issue for right now. Americans are not the enemy and if we play our cards right, we will be looking at a different Pakistan in 10 to 20 years. We can be the next Germany or Japan..

We should not leave the USA and go to China who will only use us as dumping ground for its cheap products. Look at our amount of export to China and what we import from them.

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Why pick b/w the US & China? It's an incorrect zero sum calculation in the minds of our planners. The Chinese are concerned about extremism just as much as the Americans and while they may not say anything to Pakistan publically they will expect the same.

The choices in front of Pakistan are pretty stark and it's up to our civilian and military leadership to get Pakistan out of the severe international isolation and reverse the down in the gutters image of the country.

While I shall stay eternally optimistic, the longer our leaderships sits and waits like nincompoops, the harder the reversal process.

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Why pick b/w the US & China? It's an incorrect zero sum calculation in the minds of our planners. The Chinese are concerned about extremism just as much as the Americans and while they may not say anything to Pakistan publically they will expect the same.

The choices in front of Pakistan are pretty stark and it's up to our civilian and military leadership to get Pakistan out of the severe international isolation and reverse the down in the gutters image of the country.

While I shall stay eternally optimistic, the longer our leaderships sits and waits like nincompoops, the harder the reversal process.

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we will be looking at a different Pakistan in 10 to 20 years. We can be the next Germany or Japan. Turkey

This reminded me of the term sovereignty.

Both the above countries, although mega giants in economically, are not sovereign countries.

Germany has more than 70,000 US troops occupying it since 1945. German Basic Law's (Grundgesetz or constitution) states clearly that in case of war the command of German troops will be under the Supreme Command of NATO; which is US United States Joint Forces Command (USJFCOM) formerly known as United States Atlantic Command (USLANTCOM).

In Japan, the US currently maintains more than 50,000 troops as required by Article 9 of the Constitution of the State of Japan. There are US nuclear weapons based in Germany & Japan.

It is a known fact that the author of the Japanese Constitution was Gen. D. MacArthur.

So much for being free and sovereign mega economic powers!

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This reminded me of the term sovereignty.

Both the above countries, although mega giants in economically, are not sovereign countries.

Germany has more than 70,000 US troops occupying it since 1945. German Basic Law's (Grundgesetz or constitution) states clearly that in case of war the command of German troops will be under the Supreme Command of NATO; which is US United States Joint Forces Command (USJFCOM) formerly known as United States Atlantic Command (USLANTCOM).

In Japan, the US currently maintains more than 50,000 troops as required by Article 9 of the Constitution of the State of Japan. There are US nuclear weapons based in Germany & Japan.

It is a known fact that the author of the Japanese Constitution was Gen. D. MacArthur.

So much for being free and sovereign mega economic powers!

But would you rather Pakistan to be today's Germany/Japan or today's Pakistan?

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But would you rather Pakistan to be today's Germany/Japan or today's Pakistan?

Pakistan Pakistan hay!

There is nothing like Pakistan of yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Germany, Japan, S. Korea, etc., are defeated and occupied countries. Not an hour goes by that they are not humiliated and reminded of their past.

"It is far better to live like a Tiger for a day than to live like a jackal for a hundred years." Tippu Sultan

Self respect and not standing with your head down is more than anything in this for me!

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US troops in Japan, Germany and South Korea are there with the permission of the respective govt. Hence, there are not occupiers.

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Pakistan Pakistan hay!

There is nothing like Pakistan of yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Germany, Japan, S. Korea, etc., are defeated and occupied countries. Not an hour goes by that they are not humiliated and reminded of their past.

Self respect and not standing with your head down is more than anything in this for me!

I understand the rhetoric, but give your fellow Pakistanis the choice of staying in Pakistan or settling down in those 'defeated and occupied' countries. Do you have any doubts about the majority response? Anyway thats besides the point. Those countries that you have mentioned in your above post were indeed defeated. American forces are stationed there. Pakistan is not one such country. Yet Pakistan has lost 34,000 Pakistanis thus far in a war which most Pakistanis are not even sure whether its their own or not. Still Pakistan is always expected to and told to do more, and Gop always assures US of doing exactly that. I dont understand to which 'Self Respect' category this self-respect belongs ? Let US treat those above mentioned countries in such a humiliating manner in international arena, and Im not sure if their citizens (present generation) would be as tolerant (as Pakistanis are) of their respective governments regardless of how many US troops are stationed there.

Edited by vikasrehman

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US troops in Japan, Germany and South Korea are there with the permission of the respective govt. Hence, there are not occupiers.

That's an amusing way of looking at:cool:

When did occupiers needed permission from the defeated country? Case in point is present day elected government of Iraq: Can they tell the US forces to leave their country and enforce it?

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