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#233865 Pakistan Air Force Related Discussion: Jan ~ Dec 2017

Posted by Usman S. on 09 April 2017 - 07:20 AM


JF17 is supposed to be a plug and play fighter jet, so no reason why an export model could not be the same as Pakistani version or even better. It all depends on the buyer country's negotiating position for sub-components. No reason why a Saudi version of JF17 could not have French AESA radar, avionics and missiles.

I am not aware of any sub-component developed by Pakistan itself, exporting which could compromise the Pakistani version of JF17. Almost every component is being imported and another country could get clearance for the same equipment.          



In aircraft design terms, there is no such thing as plug and play. Every component that you choose has to be integrated at some level. Main components like radar, ECM etc. require major work while some require only minor changes. Much of the JF-17 avionics are now being produced at Kamra, and this includes Weapons Mission Management Computer (WMMC), EMMC, ISR & Light Warning System (LWS), INS, SHUD, SMS & ILS with complete transfer of technology from CATIC.  CATIC transferred this tech at high cost as they were not ready to part with it. Some of sub-systems are of western origin and are also co-produced at Kamra and this includes radio, RWR, radar altimeter etc. There are also some other Chinese (non-CATIC systems) that are being produced locally such as radar, IFF transponder, IFF interrogator etc. Some systems were designed and developed locally, such as complete production of Smart Heading & Reference System (SHARS) with the help of Navtech of Singapore. Avionics Activation Panel (AAP), Up Front Control Panel (UFCP), Audio Control Box (ACB), Backup Acquisition Computer (BAC) and Smart Multi-Functional Coloured Display (SMFCD) are also indigenously designed, developed and qualified.  ´The Digital Video Recorder was designed locally as well by Strategic Task Group (STS) & there are also other locally developed sub-systems such as ACMI & Chaff and Flare Dispenser and R&S Radio from AWC on board.

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#219652 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by Gaf on 20 June 2015 - 08:34 AM

I have attended the PARIS Airshow 2015 on the 19th June, 2015. It was a bit of a mission/long day !(there and back again on the same day). However, having followed the programme since the late 90s starting off as the Super Sabre project and having lived through its various lows and highs, it was very pleasing to be on the flight line at Le Bourget and see the JF17 perform her routine in front of me.


There were some interesting observations from the routine (the black smoke issue was only ever observered during the landing sequence, otherwise it ws not visible ).. The JF17 is a lean and mean vortex generating machine! You do not realise when looking at pictures of the aircraft perform her routine, but those 2 vortexs from the LERX are virtually a permanent feature on the aircraft during her routine. The takeoff, vertically up and the following hard pull to the left while climbing is excellent to watch !


The JF17 static display has been relocated and now was placed at a location that is very inaccessible to the general public without having one of the those "magic" plastic cards some people had. It seemed to be quarantined off for access to the "professionals" only it seems. The JF17 was displayed next to the T-129 stand, so it was nice to see that too. So the first time i went, i gave up and proceeded to view the rest of the show after the security team told me to take a royal hike...


The second time i went back, "Thankfully", PAF officials did recognise the prediciment of people having come to see the aircraft and not be able to gain access to the area, so they came "out" to meet us and talk to us. That was a nice jesture, but they indicated that they had very little control over the display location. Then, there was one individual in a green shirt(I think associated with PAC/PAF ? to be honest, not sure !!! But whoever he was, ** THANKYOU ** ) who found out that they could "escort" upto 3 people at a time to get close to the JF17 and speak with the ground crew. So, a long queue formed and we took turns.. It was quite amusing to see a queue of people line up to see the plane.


One interesting item is the fact that the wet thrust of the aircraft is confirmed at 98kN Wet.


The PAF/PAC/CATIC team have done an excellent of producing a brochure of the aircraft for giving to visitors. Since, this brochure was given for FREE and it serves as an advertising tool, I have hopefully not broken any copyright by scanning and posting it here for all of you(since no £ was involved in giving it out) !! Lots of interesting facts and figures in there.


Enjoy the following brochure, it is an excellent piece of marketing !!!

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#227667 Pakistan Air Force Related Discussion: Jan ~ Dec 2016

Posted by Usman S. on 03 May 2016 - 02:25 AM

We do have the money to pay the full price but why pay so much for 08 airframes, when that same amount can be invested in another project that would give you more bang for the buck. With our meagre financial resources, those new F-16C/D seemed like a good idea, only when they were subsidized by the US government. PAF can use the money to replace its low-level radars, buy new munitions, beef up JF-17 Block-III avionics or even invest in new Chinese & Turk 5th generation projects. PAF high-ups of course know better but I am hoping we will start reducing our reliance on American made weapons. Funny thing is while we are slowly trying to reduce our reliance on American’s, the Indian’s are starting to buy more & more from them.US government uses weapons sales as a tool for policy influence & political leverage. Hopefully when we are out of this quagmire, Indians will be neck deep in it.  

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#224001 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by H Rehman on 10 December 2015 - 02:18 PM

It is a huge ego hit. If Pakistan sells JF17 to SL, then all of India's superior superpower shining technology looks hollow. The "indigenous" this and that truth is exposed. That is why they are offering a credit line and not an Indian made alternative to JF17. Can't offer MKI's because despite claiming how much Indian input went into it, it is a 100% Russian fighter. LCA just met its technical parameters during testing as defined by DRDO and HAL for the 100th time. Dhuruv's are grounded by Ecuador as they are falling out of the sky. This article should be posted in the dictionary as a definition of ButtHurt.

#218717 Why The Forum Was Down.

Posted by H Khan on 04 May 2015 - 04:01 PM

Assalamu Alaykum,

Just wanted to keep everyone appraised for the reasons why the site was down. PakDef this morning was hit by a bruteforce hacking attempt. We are going to adjust a few things to see if we can circumvent some of this. Basically, we have multiple IP's hitting the site's admin panels which causes the server to crash. No one has been able to breach anything though so we are good in terms of that. Just wanted everyone to know.


The jist of the story is that PakDef has been on the hit list of some anti-Pakistan idiots for sometime, therefore, what you folks write over here does make people loose their sleep. Also keeping the decorum should be essential part of our writing practices.


Thanks to Z for the foresight and keeping up the guard! Stay strong my friends


Thank you.

#233738 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2017

Posted by SSAAD on 31 March 2017 - 08:39 AM

FaisalK/Bilal is the admin/owner of Quwwa and he is also a member here.  I don't know him personally but I admire his passion and zeal!  The whole purpose of a blog/forum is to share ideas that go into the hypotheticals as well as dealing in facts.  Yes we need to be grounded and somewhat realistic but getting into the "what ifs" is not as bad as it is made out to be sometimes.  


Personally speaking, I hold all the admins, bloggers (whether here or at Quwwa or PDF etc.) in high regard because there is passion in what they do.  They take their own time out to write content (and on Quwwa even if we are dealing with the hypotheticals, the content is decently researched and well written!) or share their opinions.  There aren't that many Pakistani origin sites that do this.  So as long as such opinions are shared respectfully with logic and reasoning, it should be welcomed.

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#221993 Pakistan Army Pictures and Videos

Posted by ndad on 18 September 2015 - 05:43 PM

It's been said by others and I'll repeat it here, and it's no exaggeration. If it wasn't for the armed forces and young men, officers and a soldiers alike, making the ultimate sacrifice, Pak would be close to the likes of Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq, with India carving up the country.

May Allah give them the ultimate reward.

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#221271 Make Sincere Prayers For Forum Member

Posted by pshamim on 20 August 2015 - 05:01 PM

I am very grateful for all the prayers and best wishes from all my respected friends on this forum. Allah Almighty has given me strength and courage that I am able to walk couple of miles a day and about 20 laps in the swimming pool 3 times a week. My vision has not improved. It is still not very clear yet. I am still hopeful  in spite of ophthalmologists giving up on me. There is a ray of hope that I may be accepted ainto a study at National Institute of health. 


I will inshallah be posting any thing I find out but be aware that I may make a lot of mistakes when typing.


Regards, Pervez

#213953 Pakistan Air Force Pictures & Videos - VI

Posted by Usman S. on 01 August 2014 - 08:04 AM

Some high-resolution shots taken at Samungli Air Base by a good friend. Original's were too large so had to resize. Enjoy and feel free to share with due credit to Mudy (Photographer) & PakDef. 

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#227641 Pakistan Army Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2016

Posted by SSAAD on 01 May 2016 - 02:15 PM

You guys forget history very quickly.  This is the tried and tested tactic of washing their hands off the region.  Essentially you find a cause and stick all the conditions to it.  This time around it is Pakistan's support for the Haqqani network, last time it was our nuclear program.  The Obama admin will plead helplessness suggesting to GoP that the pressure is too much for them to be able to do anything about military assistance to Pakistan.  At the end of the day, why would/should the US continue to assist Pakistan when they do not have any major interests left in the region (until something else happens and then they will again come offering gifts).  So this is the situation, Pak-US are not eternal friends nor do they have any specific interests that converge.


While Americans may not put sanctions, but there is no reason for them to continue funding Pakistan's security needs.  This is where our own beghairat in the government (and the military) need to realize that if the economy cannot afford it, then it means they cannot have the goods.  Its quite simple.  There are three choices left now:


i) Divert more funding to the military at the cost of social uplift

ii) Decide we cannot do anything any more and give in to regional powers, or

iii) For once in the lifetime, take the ghairat in own hands and work hard to fix the economy, then Pakistan should float tenders for new weapon systems on the back of this economic emancipation and forget Americans, inn kay tau baap bhi aakar defence equipment sell karain gay!

All it boils down to is our ghattiya, broke as always government that caves in to these ba$tard leeches known as zameendars, industrialists and what not who will not pay a penny in taxes.  These ba$tard$ are the reason that Pakistan is perpetually stuck asking other countries' taxpayers for relief.  Its a very embarrassing and shameful thing but our ba$tard$ think its an accomplishment if they can secure some US aid instead of going out on the international market and putting our demands with firm funding on the back of it.


60 years have passed and this underperforming country of 190M people can still not sort out its issues.  

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#232149 Pakistan Navy Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2017

Posted by yasser on 16 January 2017 - 09:34 AM

Diameter isn't the issue, but length. 


Story of my life.

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#223534 Pakistan Army Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by H Khan on 18 November 2015 - 09:23 PM

PAA is saying WZ-10 is absolutely amazing much beyond their expectations. Some PA specific upgrades are requested and more than likely an order will be placed soon. With AH-1Z and WZ-10 there is no room for T129

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#219662 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by SSAAD on 20 June 2015 - 01:23 PM

As a side bar gents, I must say it is such an amazing moment of pride, Alhamdolillah, to see this aircraft fly with our own pilots. Many of us have spent countless hours discussing the challenges of PAF since the 90s and this aircraft for the first time has finally broken the shackles of dependency for us. What makes me immensly proud is that if push comes to shove, the JF-17 alone can handle the vast majority of roles the PAF expects to perform in the defence of Pakistan's aerial frontiers inshallah even if F-16s are embargoed. Perhaps I am stating the obvious but in the minute details of blocks and this and that, perhaps we are forgetting this huge blessing. Lastly this shows us what Pakistanis are truly capable of.

"Kis sher ki amad hai kay ran kaanp raha hai"

Gaf, thanks for the detailed review and pictures!
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#217814 Pak Navy Related Discussion: Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by pshamim on 31 March 2015 - 10:50 AM

[quote name="mominkhan" post="217813" timestamp="1427815789"]Welcome back, Sir.[/quotye]
Thank you Momin Khan sahib. I love to be on forum and learn from all the friends but unable to so on regular basis. While I can deal with most health issues, vision issues do hamper me. Please keep me in your prayers.
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#233791 Pakistan Air Force Related Discussion: Jan ~ Dec 2017

Posted by SSAAD on 02 April 2017 - 04:26 PM

My friend, I wish you the best in your endeavors. However, my first and foremost priority is to Pakistan. And my comments regarding Britain are based on years of extensive research, analysis of historic accounts of British involvement in parts of the world. In particular, the Islamic World.

Britain has played a pivotal role in shaping the world we see today. Things did not happen by accident, they were carefully crafted and designed by those who were in power, in the most powerful western country of the 17th & 18th Century.

Be it the shrewd entrapment and collapse of the Ottoman Empire by the Brits. Where they stood firm as an ally of the Ottomans against the French and Russian "aggression". Shrewdly playing it's enemies against each other. Exploiting the gullible, fool-hardy, trusting approach of the Russians, the Ottoman Turks or the Arabs of the Peninsula. They managed to destroy the Ottoman Caliphate from within.

Britain is the reason why there is a Wahhabi-Salafi regime, that has been the source of ISIS, AQ, NUSRA & BOKO support, sustained financial backing and ideological foundation. Yes, it is Britain that created the saudi Arabia you and I know today.


Britain is also the surrogate mother of the illegal and illegitimate state of israel. The Balfour Declaration is a the testament to how Britain was the source of the creation of a zionist state, on Palestinian land.

Britain is also the primary and fundamental instrument of the Kashmir issue. The way the partition of the former British Empire's colony (British-India) took place. The way Mountbatten handled his affairs on behalf of the British crown and the obvious and clear bias in favor of Bharat by the British. One would be a fool not to be vigilant and study these brits closely.

So you see my friend, Britain isn't just "any other state". It the source of many a world problems we experience today.

I have no issues with Pakistan Air Force or Pakistan Army or Navy establishing coordial relationship with the British aed forces. Certainly not! It is good to have cordial relationship with all countries. But when a country like Britain starts taking an interest in you. Then my friend, there ought to be a cause for concern in the minds of everyone.

I speak my mind, and call it like I see it. As I said, I have studied the history of British involvement in Arabia, Palestine, Pakistan and Turkey, in depth.

History aside, these exchanges are good for the PR and image of Pakistan.  You have to play this game on all tracks.  Can't be single-mindedly paranoid either.  Think about the large Pakistani diaspora living in the UK.  Having such relations between the adopted country and the native country is a good thing for Pak expats in the UK and also for the PAF because such types of exchanges allow for PAF to benefit from an Air Force that is getting to operationalize 5th generation aircraft before most others.  I recall there was an interview with ACM Qamar Suleman and he specifically mentioned that he had in-depth discussions with the RAF on how they are re-tooling their workforce and he said we are going to implement a lot of the same things within the PAF.  That is immense value from such exchanges.


PAF was helped in the 50s and 60s because it took the same from the USAF and implemented it.  The benefits of it are seen to this day.  Yes we must be careful about letting any outsider make inroads but if proper oversight is given, the exchanges can be very beneficial.

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#224429 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by H Khan on 30 December 2015 - 10:47 AM

It is confirmed that Myanmar will start to receive first of 16 JF-17 in January of 2017, this includes four dual-seaters.  The deal is worth $256 million plus another $100 million for the weapons from China.


Second in line is Sri Lanka. Hopefully, during NS visit to Sri Lanka next month, the deal would be signed. Even though Bharat is trying its best to sway Sri Lanka's interest but because of pressure from China Sri Lanka is keeping the track.


Nigeria is still thinking.

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#223893 Zarb-E-Azb, Cleanse The Nwa From The Terrorists/militants

Posted by zeeshan on 04 December 2015 - 03:13 PM

Assalmoalaukum news are coming in that the female shooter in the USA had pictures taken with Lal masjid Maulvi. It makes my blood boil as to why this guy is even alive. All our grand claims of eliminating terrorism and we have this guy sitting two miles from the parliament building making complete mockery of the entire state. What is army doing about this neucense? This is beyond stupid. Just when things start to look better we get this set back and no one can say we didn't see this coming. Our stupid government is sleeping.
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#221468 India-Pak Tensions & Border Violations

Posted by Aslan S. on 27 August 2015 - 04:28 PM

Apparently, this guy Faisal Qureshi had made a ballistic response to anything wrong being - said against Pakistan in movie Phantom: 






Boy! o Boy! He did hit the sweet spot of Indians  :lol:   :rolleyes:

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#220535 Jf-17 Related Discussion – Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by FaisalK on 21 July 2015 - 07:36 PM

I don't know why the IAF is worried. According to the experts at Bharat Rakshak (I think their names are Raju, Sidhu and Babu - or close) the PAF only has a fleet of 100 flying modern fighters, and that JF-17 was nothing more than a "hangar queen" (because who better than an IAF fan to know what a hangar queen is).

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#217812 Pak Navy Related Discussion: Jan ~ Dec 2015

Posted by pshamim on 31 March 2015 - 09:45 AM

Govt endorses summary to get 8 submarines from China, defence committee told

An improved version of Yuan Class 039. Proposed 6 produced in China and 2 in Pakistan with transfer of technology. Double hulled. depth 300 m.

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